Comments on: Notes from Final Z Burger Community Meeting

By: Columbia Heights Z-Burger Closer to Outdoor Eating Space, Installs Fence | Park View, D.C.

Mon, 03 Jun 2013 05:03:06 +0000

[…] in July 2011, was further addressed at the September and November 2011 meetings, was the subject of community meetings in April 2012, and finally approved by the District’s Public Space Committee in May […]

By: SLIDESHOW: Z Burger and Why Sometimes You Don't Need a Fence - Housing Complex

SLIDESHOW: Z Burger and Why Sometimes You Don't Need a Fence - Housing Complex — Fri, 04 May 2012 14:05:20 +0000

[...] be able to use the public space in front of the old Tivoli Theater in Columbia Heights. There are lots of particulars to the situation, but the sticking point is over whether Z Burger should be able to erect a fence [...]

By: AFF Doublethink Online » D.C. hurts its poorest citizens through regulations

Tue, 01 May 2012 04:11:03 +0000

[...] fight, which was summed up nicely by a local neighborhood blog, essentially revolves around whether or not the restaurant can put a [...]

By: IP

IP — Thu, 26 Apr 2012 13:27:03 +0000

How about one of those invisible f ences that they advertise for dogs?

By: JG in DC

JG in DC — Wed, 25 Apr 2012 16:51:07 +0000

Lost in this discussion is that the addition of a fence completely violates the original plans for the space for the Columbia Heights civic plaza — which was developed with extensive community involvement, and which the Z-Burger crew seems to not really give a crap about. It seems that their general response has been to just come in and demand what they want, and then threaten to leave if they don’t get their way.

Let’s be clear: Z-Burger KNEW about this design and restriction when they signed the lease for the place, and has since then worked to undermine it, rather than try to find a way to live within the constraints of the plaza’s design. If they wanted to be like “all the other cafes in the area” then they should have never picked a spot that was part of the plaza. It’s not like any of this was unknown to them.

The notion of a firm coming in and basically saying “the hell with what the community worked to accomplish with the civic plaza — we want it like this instead” doesn’t do much to inspire confidence that they’ll actually be a good member of the community. I’m glad the community and the ANC is standing up and trying to do something about it.

By: Katie

Katie — Wed, 25 Apr 2012 14:21:11 +0000

Honestly, having more restaurants with outdoor seating will IMPROVE the atmosphere! This section of Columbia heights is an attractive and welcoming place for people to spend time outside in a bustling urban environment. Having a place for people to eat an inexpensive meal outside will help this environment not hurt it. The fence issue is ridiculous–almost every other restaurant with outside seating has a fence. A fence takes up far less sidewalk space than a planter (inches vs. feet) and it’s very easy to find attractive fencing. I am so frustrated about this since it seems that what people want (a pleasant urban outside atmosphere) is the very thing they are fighting against!

By: New Columbia Heights (@newcolumbiahts)

New Columbia Heights (@newcolumbiahts) — Tue, 24 Apr 2012 19:08:14 +0000

Thanks for this readout Kent. I agree about the fences, it’s not like they are the end of world. In fact, Alero up the street has one!

http://maps.google.com/?ll=38.931088,-77.032764&spn=0.014656,0.031414&hnear=1400+Irving+St+NW,+Washington,+District+of+Columbia+20010&t=m&z=16&layer=c&cbll=38.930988,-77.032777&panoid=7azRKey9Uj653qYsJ2mHKA&cbp=12,76.66,,0,-0.25

By: JS

JS — Tue, 24 Apr 2012 15:55:39 +0000

It’s ridiculous that this has taken as long as it has. I honestly don’t understand the hangup about a fence – it looks like meddling for meddling’s sake, not any type of constructive effort that will improve the outcome.

Things like this make the average citizen sour on ANCs in general.

By: stevedavis78

stevedavis78 — Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:42:21 +0000

I’d have to say that I totally understand their desire for a fence or barrier of some kind. To me, it doesn’t damage the aesthetic of the public space in the triangle at all, it makes it clear that it’s seating for that particular restaurant. (And it’s not that deep at all, taking a bare minimum of sidewalk space, still preserving the extremely wide sidewalk there. Reasonable design on the plans I’ve seen.)

Good urbanity usually dictates that it’s good to create a bit of an outdoor “room” for these kinds of spaces. If I’m eating there, I don’t want people walking through the tables accidentally, and I want to have the feeling that I’m part of the public space but also slightly separate. (Red Rocks patio creates this by virtue of its slight elevation.)

This doesn’t strike me as an unreasonable request from the owners. Provided the materials used for any sort of railing are compatible with the design and aesthetic of the civic plaza materials and color.

All that said, it does seem like something less fixed and permanent would work just as well. Like attractive stanchions that are movable with an attractive colored rope/chain between them that can be moved at the end of the business day, along with the chairs and tables (as I assume they will be.) There are lots of options for movable railings and borders that are flexible and attractive.

http://www.publicspacefanatic.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/streetscapes_unfriendly_sidewalk_cafe_guardrails.jpg
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4094/4907812994_8d0e1894bc.jpg

I think his comment that planters would “require maintenance” is telling — we want you to have something of a quality that you need to maintain. Good public spaces require maintenance!

But I do NOT want to see this disagreement result in the total loss of outdoor seating here. We need more outdoor seating and engagement with the public realm, not less.

By: RT

RT — Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:18:06 +0000

Yeah Kent, I think you guys are being ridiculous here. Overly meddlesome ANCs obstructing ordinary business yet again in the city.